Thought for the Day: No, You May Not Grape Jelly During the Nine Days; Yes, You Should be *VERY* Wary of Getting a P'sak Halacha from AI

The OU has a very nice program called Halach Yomi that consists of a daily (except legal holidays) email that covers a broad range of halachic topics. (More about this program and to subscribe here.) In a recent Halachi Yom, the topic of food made with even small amounts of meat or wine was discussed. My wife and I read and discuss them in the morning during breakfast. After reading/learning through the email, my wife asked, "So what about grape jelly?" Hmmm... good question. I never thought about it, nor had I seen it discussed. I decided to do some research.

In the old days, I would have just Googled for any references to grape jelly, nine days, Tisha b'Av, etc. Then I would have perused the hits until I found something relevant/interesting. I like to do research before talking with the dayan so I don't waste his time. Now we have AI, so that saves me time also, right? Well...

Let me walk you through my journey. I decided to start my research be looking for the bracha on grape jelly. Why? Because I reasoned that it would be a better first search and return more results. First question:

What is the bracha on grape jelly and please give me the sources or sites that you find.

I got a bunch of sources for the bracha on jellies and jams, according to both Ashkenazi and Sephardic customs. I pushed deeper:

That's all good for everything that's not grape. Just like grape juice has a different braha than juices in general. Perhaps grape jelly has a different bracha than jellies in general.

Nope. No sources were found that thatsay that grape jelly has a different bracha. Ok, now on to the main event:

Is there anyone who's stringent about not eating grape jelly or grape jam during the nine days?

Let me quote you a bit of the answer I got:

No, there is no halachic source, custom, or stringency (chumra) that prohibits or advises against eating grape jelly or grape jam during the Nine Days.

[...lots of reasons why there shouldn't be any restrictions on grape jelly...]

Thus, you can eat grape jelly or grape jam during the Nine Days without hesitation.

I don't know about you, but that last statement ending with "without hesitation" just really irked me and my halachik sensitivities. I pushed back:

Now that's a very positive statement, that last sentence, that you can eat grape jelly or grape jam in nine days without hesitation. What's your source for that?

AI doubles down:

The source for this ruling comes directly from the definitions of the prohibition of wine and grapes during the Nine Days established in the Talmud, the Shulchan Aruch, and contemporary halachic authorities (poskim):

[...lots of reasonable sounding sources...]

Because there is no halachic category or recorded custom (minhag) extending the mourning restrictions of the Nine Days to solid fruit spreads or to grapes in general, grape jelly remains fully permissible.

One more chance, AI, let me ask very directly:

Did you find a source who explicitly said your last statement or is that an extension you are doing from your programming?

You'll love this response. I know I did:

That final statement is a direct halachic deduction rather than a word-for-word quote found in a text.

No halachic source writes the explicit sentence, "You can eat grape jelly during the Nine Days without hesitation," because halachic codes do not typically write permissive rulings for foods that were never subject to a restriction in the first place. 

There are so many red flags in that last response, not the least of which is the snarky tone.

Needless to say, I was not convinced.

Just to give a bit more umph to the question:

Under U.S. FDA regulations, grape jelly must contain at least 45% fruit juice (by weight) and 55% sugar. Because the juice used is evaporated to a concentrate, it typically contributes between 35% to 45% of the jelly’s total weight, with added sweeteners, pectin, and trace acidifiers making up the rest.

I know that jelly is not a beverage, but it starts out that way. I know that grape juice and even wine lose their unique status and are lowered to a simple שהכל once diluted to 1/6 (way, way before the usual 1/60). So even according to that leniency, there's a lot of grape juice going on there; it is certainly the main ingredient, and it is certainly there for taste, so... it certainly sounds like one should not eat it during the Nine Days.

So now I just reached out to the OU and CRC directly. Both answered that one is not permitted to eat grape jelly during the Nine Days.

Why didn't I just go to the OU and CRC first? Because I like to do my research first and really understand the topic before getting a p'sak halacha. Also, I discussed this question with many chavrusos and talmidei chachamim first... no one knew nor had even thought about it. That also made the whole topic just more interesting to me. We don't have any grape jelly at home, so it wasn't urgent to know. I mean, do I need more evidence that this will be fun?

What most surprised me about the AI tool was the confidence and snarkiness with which it responded. When it comes to medical questions, each response is couched and preceded with "Of course, this is for informational purposes only."But for halacha, the responses were arrogantly positive about the correctness of the reply. Moreover, the tool was dismissive of each and every attempt to question the conclusion.

There are two major outcomes for me from this experiment. First, while I knew that the information AI tools return needs to be checked and double-checked. This reveals something much more insidious: There are baked-in prejudices to the algorithms that are completely hidden.

Second, and something that always requires strengthening: I am so grateful that HaShem provided me with such an amazing shidduch. A true partner who exemplifies and lives up to the title עזר כנגדו.